There’s probably no drink in the beverage alcohol space that’s simultaneously more familiar to American drinkers, yet less marketed and branded as sake. Everyone’s tried it. Everybody has some idea of what it is, but if someone said, “name a sake — any sake,” most would admittedly be a little tongue-tied.

It’s a category in which stateside brand building has been somewhat absent over the years. But now, through unique packaging, pitching the drink as a cocktail ingredient, or a slept-on pairing with myriad cuisines, there are a few brands making moves to change that phenomenon.

On this episode of the “VinePair Podcast,” Zach is joined by Sake ONO CEO Lana Buchanan to discuss the tremendous growth potential for sake in American drinking culture. While widely known and appreciated, sake has rarely been able to escape the confines of the most traditional drinking occasions. Buchanan outlines her team’s efforts to change the conversation around sake, how branding and packaging are crucial to that effort, and some of the surprising successes they’ve had so far.

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This podcast is sponsored by Sake ONO.